Only in the UK....???? .... food for thought....

[UK RANCHERO]

What do you guys and gals think............

A woman wrote the best 'Letter to the Editor' in ages!!


She cuts to the chase and explains things better than all the
rubbish you hear on TV.

Her letter said: Recently, large demonstrations have taken place
across the country protesting the fact that parliament is finally
addressing the issue of illegal immigration.

Certain people are angry that the UK might actually want to protect
its own borders, might make it harder to sneak into this country
and, once here, make it harder (as an illegal immigrant) to stay
indefinitely.

Let me see if I correctly understand the thinking behind these
protests.
Let's say I break into your house.

Then, when you discover me in your house, you insist that I leave.
But I say, 'I've made all the beds and washed the dishes and done
the laundry and swept the floors; I've done all the things you don't
like to do.

I'm hard-working and honest (except for when I broke into your
house).

According to the protesters, not only must you let me stay, you must
add me to your family's insurance plan, educate my kids, and provide
other benefits to me and to my family (my husband will do your yard
work)because he too is hard-working and honest, except for that
breaking-in part.

If you try to call the police or force me out, I will call my
friends who will picket your house carrying signs that proclaim my
illegal right to be there. It's only fair, after all, because you
have a nicer house than I do, and I'm just trying to better myself.

I'm hard-working and honest, um, except for well, you know.

And what a deal it is for me!! I live in your house, contributing
only a fraction of the cost of my keep, and there is nothing you can
do about it without being accused of selfishness, prejudice and
being an anti-housebreaker. Oh yeah, and I want you to learn my
language so you can communicate with me! English is too hard for me
to learn. You should also allow me to vote - in my own language,
since I live in your house!

Why can't people see how ridiculous this is?

Only in the UK

If you agree, pass it on (in English). Share it if you see the value
of it as a good simile.

If not, Delete it, along with your future.

[trikar]

Originally posted by UK RANCHERO:
Only in the UKThat's the only error I found in what was said.

[BlueOvals]

Sadly it is becoming an international phenomena, all the developed world is becomeing infested with turd worlders, legal and illegal. See anyone clamboring to get into Banledesh or Mey-hhecco illegally do you? Not f'ing likely!!! After thousands of years to make some kind of civiization out of what ever it was, as in our case (USA) a savage wilderness, they have given up on their homelands in the turd world, and they flee in droves to come here and make dung heaps out of our precious patriots' blood purchased lands. Again, not likely to happen as long as we don't role over and let them. That, of course, would be the liberal way (and idiot rhinos like "Mc Amnesty" and "Bush the stupid"), "kumbaya my brethern", but, hopefully, their short lived reign is coming to a close all over the world. Look at France, for a recent example of people just f'ing fed up with the "perversity of diversity", for diversity's sake. We welcome all races here, always have, but they have to adapt and contribute to our society we have built at great cost and with great pride; they must not try to pattern it after the crappy place they have just left, often with only the rags on their backs. If they are wiling to work hard, as generations of European and other immigrants have in the 18 century to the present, then those rags may turn to riches, but you can't get rich on welfare, me laddo! If they love the culture of those turd world sh*t holes so much, then they are free to return, and we may even pay them to leave, as Sarcozy is proposing to do in France. It would be cheaper in the long run, but they can't come back, unless it is through legal immigration channels.

[burninbush]

After thousands of years to make some kind of civiization out of what ever it was, as in our case (USA) a savage wilderness, they have given up on their homelands in the turd world, and they flee in droves to come here and make dung heaps out of our precious patriots' blood purchased lands.>blue

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Thousands of years? Blood purchased? Blue, what are you drinking today? Didn't we in fact just buy most of this country from foreigners and steal the rest from the Indians?

[Marauder359]

Vae victis.

[75 Squire]

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: Here we go again.

[Marauder359]

All I'm saying is that people who think we took this land illegally need to consider what that means. For something to be illegal it needs to be expressly made illegal. I don't recall the magna carta or the traditional constitutional framework of Britain containing anything about a local people's rights to their lands.

Now, you might suggest that it was their land because they were here before us. So? It's not like they genetically spawned in North America. Whether it was us taking it from them or them taking it from some wild animals, I believe the first people that would tell you it wasn't their land was them. We couldn't have taken the land if, when we arrived, they told us of their claim on it. Instead, they believed that nobody could OWN land. Well, I think they've changed their notion of that in the last couple centuries, but that was a bit late. The point is, I was born here, they were born here, neither of us were genetically from here. My ancestors got in a boat, their ancestors took a long walk over a land bridge.

Who does Rome belong to? The ancient Romans? The germanic hoardes of barbarians that invaded? How about the Sabines? Afterall, it was their land prior to 753 BC, I say we find them and give it back... or at the very least give the ole Sabines some casinos.

The point is that some people think being an American means showing up and being in America. It doesn't remotely. The reference to a thousand years was undoubtedly about our culture, not the particular lands we occupied while having said culture. Unfortunately for us, leftists don't realize that we actually have a culture, and that that culture is valuable and valid. The American civilization didn't start in 1776 or even in 1619 or 1607 or anything like that... The American civilization, our ideals, customs, our culture itself is much, much older.

So if we want to quibble about our society's age, let's quibble like a little bitch rather than discuss the point at hand.

[burninbush]

The American civilization didn't start in 1776 or even in 1619 or 1607 or anything like that... The American civilization, our ideals, customs, our culture itself is much, much older.

So if we want to quibble about our society's age, let's quibble like a little bitch rather than discuss the point at hand. >Marauder

++++++++++++

Wonderful -- American culture was alive and well -- somewhere -- in 1007 A.D., never mind they didn't know it. And they were apparently fighting bloody wars to preserve it. Maybe someone here will identify those early Americans with some more specificity.

I don't think there's a history or civics teacher in the country who would agree with your view of American history and/or culture. Nor would an English teacher for that matter.

So what is the point at hand? Immigration is bad? Now that I'm here, it has to stop? Only WASPs get to decide? I beat-up the previous owner, so now it belongs to me by divine right?

[UK RANCHERO]

BB, the point I was making by posting the letter, is that here in the UK we have immigrants coming over (illegally) with absolutely no plans to work or integrate into society. They are happy to sit on benefits without contributing a farthing to the economy, they then set up their own no go areas where the average english man fears to go... this is no fantasy make believe, it is happening here and now.......

I welcome anyone into this country so long as they are going to integrate, work and contribute.

I lived in mainland Spain for 10 years, I worked, I contributed, I learned the Spanish language, castello, (and some Valenciano).
I was made extremely welcome because I made the effort.
How can anyone expect to sit on their fat lazy arses and have everything given to them on a plate....
Shit, mankind would have died out just after the dinosaurs, if no one could be bothered to go and hunt and provide for their families......

[burninbush]

I welcome anyone into this country so long as they are going to integrate, work and contribute.

I lived in mainland Spain for 10 years, I worked, I contributed, I learned the Spanish language, castello, (and some Valenciano).
I was made extremely welcome because I made the effort. >UK

++++++++++++++++

Cool -- I don't disagree with any of that.

We have a large redneck element in our American society who seem to think that only they have a 'natural' right to be here -- never mind that except for a few Indians everybody here who speaks English came from somewhere else -- or their parents did. One even asserts we real Americans fought bloody wars 1000 years ago to pre-claim this land for our American culture. Flunked American History, I guess. Ours is a white-trash culture more than anything else, mostly people who couldn't make it in European society, came here hoping for a better deal. Not unlike the immigrants who are currently causing all the fuss here.

It's easy to glance at a map of California [most populous] and see that the names of the cultural centers aren't European origin. I grew up in Oklahoma -- many of the town names there are Indian origin. Oklahoma = 'home of the red man' in Choctaw.

[burninbush]

are you fuckin kidding me?
"hoping for a better deal"?
there was NO DEAL, most of them died! >2seater

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Not kidding at all. Some came because of religious persecution [and not having to endure that was the better deal] -- but most came for simple economic reasons, basically the same reason that Mexicans cross over today. Why would anybody emigrate for a worse deal? The answer to that is that they wouldn't and they didn't.

Can illegal immigrants actually get Social Security? I believe the truth of that is that they can't, but they sure as heck can and do pay into that account -- with no hope of ever getting anything back. One of the issues of ID'ing illegals is to be able to verify that the SS number all workers claim to have is really valid. And of course they pay sales tax and gas tax and utilities taxes, etc. every time they buy stuff.

Much of what Americans buy [food, products, services] is cheaper because of cheap illegal labor. Would it cost more to support them, or to pay higher prices without them? I'm not sure --

[trikar]

1. There are more than 12,000,000 illegal aliens
in this country.
2. It does not take 12,000,000 people to pick
crops in this Country, only a very small
percentage of illegal aliens work by picking
crops. Most do jobs that any other American
with less than a college degree would be
willing to do. There are plenty of people
here legally to fill the job market, and the
next people that should be in line for any job
are the people going through the proper legal
process to enter this Country. Nobody likes
someone who cuts in line.

3. Whet few jobs that there really are that most
American will not do, can be done by prison
labor of those caught entering this country
illegaly. First offense 1 months and then
deported back to their home country. Second
offense 6 months. Third offense 2 years. We
need to stop rewarding these people for
violating the law. To give these people
citizenship just because so many of them have
disrespected our country by violating our
immigration laws would be the same as
legalizing bank robbery in Los Angeles
because it is done so often.

[ June 25, 2007, 01:18 AM: Message edited by: trikar ]

[BlueOvals]

BB, the point of this thread is that illegals come to the developed world, sponge off it and then expect to be granted citizenship and all the benefits that accrue simply for being here. We citizens are fed up with that scenario, but they can come here legally (as I did from Canada years ago) and we'd welcome them, if they adopt our culture, obey our laws, and contribute to our society (they way I did by serving in the Army while still a Canadian), otherwise they can go home to that culture they loved so much that they had to flee it. That seems a simple enough thing to discuss, but you go off on tangents like we stole the land from Indians. And we did develop this land into a civilization that the whole world recognizes today as a first class one, over the past 300+ years, that's why the illegals and legals alike want to come here instead of choosing the many third world lands that can bearly feed themselves and still sh*t into their drinking water!! We are not like the Indians who bickered amongst themselves, lived in huts, for countless millenia before we conquored them, or the Mexicans who were just too weak to withstand us, that done in exactly the same way that many other races conguered others over the millenia of world history, such as the way the Romans conquered my German and French (Gaul) ancenstors. Should I now seek reparations from the Italians for stealing our lands? The arguement is the same, and I'm willing to be as agrieved as the Indians, if I wanted to make that case, instead I move on and leave the Italians out of it. Besides my ancestors eventully took their lands back, and struck back at Rome, as they organized into the "barbarian" tribes of that region of Europe, the Goths, the Franks, etc., the honorable way, by the sword, not by begging for considerations and reparations. As for cheap labor, well ok, I agree we have it, but not all 12 million or more are out there picking lettuce, flipping burgers, and making beds in motels. As Trikar said, not all are contributing, many are criminals and on the welfare rolls. If we need the labor, we can import them on work visas, as we have before, the Braserros, and they can work and then go home. We don't need to make citizens of them, we don't really need them; they drain more than they contribute to our society and they are too lazy to even learn our language, that's why we resent them. However, we do need the doctor who came here from Ghana, who is in line to immigrate legally, and has much to contribute to our society, even though he may end up being tasked to give free medical aid to illegals!!

[ForistellFord]

This is just another example of how far left the libs have gone. The guy sounds like he's actually willing to fight for the ILLegals "right" to be here more than his own. Yes, he is actually one of US, whether he likes it or not. A self-stinging WASP I guess? These kinds of diatribes are written by him for one of two reasons:

1.) He is actually an illegal alien posing as a regular legal US citizen or

2.) H doesn't believe what he's saying; he's just doing it to get his so called "redneck red stater's" dander up. It does work.

[351driver]

Originally posted by burninbush:
We have a large redneck element ..........Ours is a white-trash culture more than anything else.........Yee-haw! That's us allright......Oh, wait...I thought you meant Ranchero owners....Sorry! ;)

[burninbush]

That seems a simple enough thing to discuss, but you go off on tangents like we stole the land from Indians. >blue

++++++++++++

My friend, I commented on two specific things from a previous post of yours, and then some other folks took the thread into the weeds for a while arguing about the details of that.

I don't see anything in your most recent ramble that seems like a response, so I s'pose you were drunk when you wrote your next to last post and are now too embarrassed about it to defend the thousand-year-old American culture you alluded to.

We've been way lucky here. Didn't have to fight anybody except for skirmishes with the local aborigines, and there were enough natural resources that we could then buy what we couldn't steal. It would be hard to describe the 'conquest' of this land as a glorious fight after the initial war of the Revolution.

I'm as much Indian as anything else -- my great grandfather is named on a state monument in Oklahoma -- an early Cherokee schoolteacher and politician. Bickering is my racial heritage.

[BlueOvals]

BB, you are right, threads here have a way of getting off topic, and so sorry about your loss of lands, oh son of a great Okie Chocktaw chief, but to the victors go the spoils of war; its our country now. You all are welcome to take up the sword or the tommahawk and take it back however, just like my barbarian Germanic forefathers did to Rome, fathers side, and they also stopped the Muslims in France (the Franks in 732 at Battle of Poitiers), my mothers side. As for the thousands of years reference, maybe I was not clear; it was not about here, America, but there, countries I so insolently call the "turd world". Why has it taken so long to develop a culture, in many countries around the equator that, on the most basic of human levels, no longer poops in the water? And why have they not invented stuff lately that is usable to advance a society, technologilcally speaking? I'll cede the art and philosophy, and oh yes, the Zero, and body pack bomb, and IED to them however. That was my point, contorted as it may sound to you: we have contributed to human societal growth, on a planetary scale; they have not. We walked on the moon, they never will, unless we invite them as our guests. No I don't drink to excess when I type on the computer, and my heritage is Teutonic/Frankish and not aboriginal, so I guess "fire water" doesn't usually have a strong affect on me as it did your ancestors, despite our ancestrial great love of beer and wine ;)

[BlueOvals]

BB, Oops, sorry, it's Cherokee you are decended from; no offense meant, I know Indians are sensitive about that, getting the tribal affiliations correct. Was married to one, in part, once.

[burninbush]

Why has it taken so long to develop a culture, in many countries around the equator that, on the most basic of human levels, no longer poops in the water? And why have they not invented stuff lately that is usable to advance a society, technologilcally speaking?>Blue

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My theory is that it depends on how difficult it is to live off the land -- when it's tough and cold you have to invent more complicated ways to survive. The coastal Indians that lived here in my neighborhood never got much beyond beads and baskets, no evidence they did any farming -- and I imagine it's the same for the temperate regions of Africa.

Ever see a movie named "Quest For Fire"? A good watch, touches on some of that.

[BlueOvals]

BB, I agree, "necessity being the mother of invention" and all that, and long lonely cold winter nights in temperate zone Earth to contemplate, experiment, and invent stuff, despite the perils of going against the Church. Many good features on the History and Science channels chronicling the lives of great inventors and scientists of Europe, recent America, and Asia too. And I think disease and parasites may play a role in hampering and debilitating populations in the tropical climes; just my theory, many exceptions in both directions though. Yes, I love that movie, "Quest for Fire"; own a copy and like to watch it on a cold night, with my wood stove going.