A quick question RE: 460 PI engine

Discussion in 'General Automotive Questions' started by handy_andy_cv64, Apr 25, 2017.

  1. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    She fired! And ran two seconds on starting fluid. Pulled off the fuel inlet line, NO fuel. Checked the gas gauge, EMPTY. Apparently, Joe's big brother must've siphoned the tank at some point....
     

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  2. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    Also, the accelerator pump decided to cause problems *just because*
    So now I have to deal with that....
     
  3. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    Sooooooo...we put fuel in yesterday, I poured a bit down the vent into the float bowl, but after repeated cranking/starting fluid shots, we still could only get it to run for two seconds and die. The accelerator pump wasn't shooting, and it seemed like the engine vacuum wasn't drawing fuel. I rechecked the idle mixture screws, the driver side was in 3/4 turn, but other than that, no fire on its own. We blew air through the lines, they were all clear (and we shot fuel against the garage wall...), but no vacuum at the fuel tank during cranking.
    Today, when Joe got off work, we ran and got a new pump, installed it, and after several cranks with the line off, it was pumping fuel. I hooked back up to the carb, we cranked it several times, and she fired, without starting fluid! I ran the engine speed up to keep it from dying, for about a minute, then shut it off. I still have work to do on the vac lines before we run it to dial in the timing, but it's at 30* dwell, and new plugs, low-miles cap, rotor, wires, points and condenser, we should have it ready to move under its own power soon! we're hoping the exhaust on that Grand Marq is still there, as the original exhaust won't bolt up correctly to the D5AE-A manifolds. So we are close! Close enough to thumb our noses at the city, who today have given us seven days to license our work truck and the Galaxie. Effing PITA next-door neighbor.
     
  4. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    She's mostly dialed in on timing, carb idle mixture and speed's next, plus get the choke t-stat to work. Unfortunately, her power steering puked in the driveway so that'll need to be looked at. And because we fired off the Bear so we could garage her (we had an open-manifold cacklefest going), the idiot next-door-neighbor couldn't call Code Compliance so he called the cops. When the officer walked up the driveway, I warned her about the puked fluid, then I said: "Lemme guess...a certain snitch called to complain about noise?" That caught her off-guard, then I turned on the charm, told her what we were doing, mentioned the Galaxie was a PI, yadda yadda, she said that he wasn't hearing any noise, so she headed off.
     
  5. Hillbilly

    Hillbilly In Maximum Overdrive

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    When you get the Bear buttoned up and civilized, hunt her up and offer her a ride for coffee in the old school style. Officers of any age have a weak spot for the huge old cruisers. Some remember all the room they had and the others wish they still had real cars to drive on their beats. Might get you some referals for jobs and possibly an in on maintence of their current fleet if you wanted. Wouldn't that frost the douch next door ?
     
  6. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    Yeah, except we couldn't do work there. But the "Go for a ride in a PI" that's "outta this world" would certainly frost him, especially when using the Twinsonic in 'siren, wail and yelp' modes....
     
  7. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    Anyway, dumped kitty litter down, pulled the Barge up to the garage door, with Annie, the '88 CP, pulled up behind her. We have the pump from the LTD, but we weren't able to get the steering gearbox, which is where I think the leak is. So, I'll look at the cars here at the classic yard, see if I can find a good one.
     
  8. Hillbilly

    Hillbilly In Maximum Overdrive

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    Odd thing about those full size steering gears, my 1978 PI Mercury came with a box having 1966 casting numbers and a 1966 build date on the id plate. That gives you a huge range of years that fit. Must have had a warehouse full of them to use up.
     
  9. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    What sucks is that when they did the downsizing in 1979, the engineers changed the hookups, so it'll bolt up to a Panther, but the input coupling and Pitman arm will not hook up.
     
  10. Hillbilly

    Hillbilly In Maximum Overdrive

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    I don't count the 79 and up as full size. More like a Chevelle and the Town Car close to a 1967 Cutlass four door. Save for the Lincoln, my big feet don't fit in the back seat of a Panther.
     
  11. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    I can't even climb out of the back seat of a Panther!

    So I went to the classic J/Y today, scored the exhaust off that Grand Marquis I got the 460 manifolds from...gotta take it to an exhaust shop, as sedan exhaust and wagon exhaust are different behind the rear axle! But with the Flowmasters, it sure had a purty burble to them!

    I have a video, but 1) I don't know how to downsize it for posting, and 2) I don't know how to edit it for the one f-bomb I dropped.
     
  12. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    Soooooo, we thought the power steering was leaking badly (TBF, it is leaking), but as it turns out, the engine is *dumping* oil at the back end, straight down the center of the separator plate. We have the oil pan off and pulled the 3-year-old rear main seal, and I'm not seeing any damage to it, plus it was correctly installed. Once we get it back together, if it still leaks, we'll have to yard the trans, look at the back of the block.
     
  13. Hillbilly

    Hillbilly In Maximum Overdrive

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    Not many options for a big leak on the rear of a 385 series. First to look at is the oil pressure sender. Two piece rear seal ? If converted from a rope seal make sure the pointy seal locating pin in the main cap is ground off flush. On that main cap make sure to put a bead of rtv at both sides where it meets the block surface. If the leak isn't at the main seal all that's left is the cam bore plug and the oil galley plugs. Might beg, borrow, or rent a bore scope camera and poke it up between the block and flexplate before you go to the trouble of separating everything.
     
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  14. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    I wish I knew someone with a borescope. I'm fairly convinced that either a plug backed out or the cam plug opened up, it's coming straight down the center. The oil pressure sender is new, and I had a good look. Also, you should've seen the accumulated junk in the pan and the sump screen. Some of it actually looked like veggie matter, if you ask me! And when Joe originally did the rear main, he found five dead scorpions in it! But, no pin, it was a factory rubber seal originally, the seal was correctly installed, the only thing about the cap is that Joe used too little of RTV. Of course, mechanic that I am, I Betty Crockered that pan gasket set. So, once back together, we'll run it, see if it leaks again, and if so, we'll pull the trans, get a look-see.
     
  15. Hillbilly

    Hillbilly In Maximum Overdrive

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    Almost sounds like someone in the past got rough whacking on a replacement cam gear and timing set.
     
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  16. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    Hmmmmmm......
     
  17. plumcolr

    plumcolr In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    That would be my guess. Is there a thrust washer on the front of the cam? Had a y block that pushed out the freeze plug behind the cam.
     
  18. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    Even with a thrust plate, hammering the gear on will still push the shaft backward. Cam 101...you use the cam bolt to gently pull the cam and gear together.
     
  19. handy_andy_cv64

    handy_andy_cv64 In Maximum Overdrive SILVER MEMBER

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    I hoping I'm not getting fooled by the engine, but it may have been leaking from the rear main cap. I finally finished putting it back together, fired it up and ran it at around 15-1600 RPM for a minute, and no leakies. Please say a few prayers for its continued health.

    I'm about to put it on the ground, and once I do, I'll slip a pan under and fire it back up, let it get hot, check for coolant leaks and top off the power steering, see if that leak's major or not.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2021
  20. pmrphil

    pmrphil In Maximum Overdrive GOLD MEMBER

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    Maybe a dumb question, but did you seal the bellhousing bolt that goes into the valley?
    Was the rear cap torqued about right when you took it off? As in, not loose.
    I own a machine shop, and as of yet have never seen a cam plug leak as bad as you're describing. I have seen a couple of block pipe plugs on rebuilt engines that were not tightened enough.
     

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